[91311] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] QangHom
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Steven Boozer)
Mon Dec 19 09:43:41 2011
From: Steven Boozer <sboozer@uchicago.edu>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:43:25 -0600
In-Reply-To: <BAY166-W27E1C806D3F1B7D3711E3DAAA00@phx.gbl>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
Voragh:
>> I tend to use {qup} "elder" for this (especially for "senator"); cp.
>> {quprIp} "Council of Elders". =A0I don't know if {qup} refers to an
>> honored, traditional leader or just someone elderly.
=
Philip:
>> Given that it's the "opposite" of {puq} "child", I had always
>> assumed that it referred to anyone older.
Remember that we also have *{qanwI'} "old person", the nomen agentis of {qa=
n} "be old (not young)". See Okrand on the homonym {qan} "use the little f=
inger":
HQ 10.2:9: In addition to {qan} "use the little finger, use the pinkie", t=
here is another verb {qan} meaning "be old (not young)". No doubt because o=
f this resemblance, when one points at someone using the little finger [qan=
wI'}], or when one remarks on this pointing, the pointer is making a commen=
t on the age of the person being pointed to.
qI'empeqDaq jIqan =
(I think that) K'mpec is old
("I point at K'mpec with my little finger") (HQ 10.2)
qan qI'empeq =
K'mpec is old. (HQ 10.2:9)
De'vID:
> But surely, a {quprIp} is a council not just of elderly people, but
> of elderly people who are distinguished in some way.
QeS:
> To complicate things, I wonder if older people in Klingon culture
> might be venerated or considered distinguished simply *because*
> they're older. There might be no functional difference between
> "elderly person" and "traditional leader".
> [....]
> As for Klingons, given that they're expected to kill a superior if
> they show signs of incompetence, maybe a Klingon who even makes it
> to old age is automatically venerated as a particularly able person,
> since he or she must have been very competent or skilled to avoid
> being offed at some point by a greedy subordinate.
Some references to throw into the mix...
KGT 133: Klingons revere their ancestors, respect their elders, and have u=
nparalleled veneration for heritage. [...] Younger Klingons, while acceptin=
g their heritage and observing the ancient rites, see some aspects of their=
elders' behavior and beliefs as, if not obsolete, then just old-fashioned.
KGT 90: As he describes the thrill of his first hunt, Toq (Sterling Macer)=
reminds his elders of what it is to be Klingon.
SuvwI'pu' qan tu'lu'be' =
There are no old warriors. TKW
qan; QI'tu' rur =
He/she is as old as Qui'Tu. KGT =
qanchoHpa' qoH, Hegh qoH =
Fools die young. TKW
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons
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