[90911] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] paq'batlh: VERBS USED AS NOUNS
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (De'vID jonpIn)
Sat Nov 26 18:34:39 2011
In-Reply-To: <COL124-W43873F15BD5E6502480858F2CC0@phx.gbl>
Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2011 00:34:08 +0100
From: "De'vID jonpIn" <de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com>
To: KLI <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
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'ISqu':
> Clear cases:
>
> {tuj} =96 n. heat
>
> Their anger so hot,
> It could melt the rock
> tujqu'choHmo' QeHchaj
> nagh tetlaH tujvam
> (pp 76-77)
>
This isn't a new word. It's on TKD p. 110/136. :-)
> {puj} =96 n. weakness
>
> United to do battle together!
> Against fear and against weakness!
> SuvvIpghach puj je
> HarghmeH yeq chaH
> (pp 118-119)
>
The entire line reads:
nItebHa' molor HI''a'
SuvvIpghach puj je
HarghmeH yeq chaH
I read {puj} as an adjective here when I first read it {SuvvIpghach puj}
"weak fear of fighting", and read the {je} as connecting that and {molor
HI''a'}. It's not an impossible reading, though {SuvvIpghach puj} is a
very confusing term. You're probably right that {puj} is a noun here.
{ghom} =96 n. assembly
>
> SIqral bIQtIq ghom
> Assembly at the River Skral
> (pp 140-141, 202-203)
>
> The word cannot be a verb because then the line would mean
> "They meet the River Skral", which doesn't make sense in the
> light of what happens in the book.
>
Again, {ghom} was already known as a noun. It's given as "group, party"
in TKD p. 86, 135 and as "band, group, part" in KGT p. 214. "Assembly" is
just another English translation of the same concept.
> [... poD ...]
> All of these are titles of specific cantos with the exception of {ngaS},
> which can also be considered as a type of heading naming a section in a
> book.
The sections of the book are called {paq'yav}, {paq'raD}, and {paq'QIH}.
{yav} and {QIH} exist as nouns, but {raD} is a verb only (AFAIK). But
perhaps book or chapter titles do not follow normal grammatical rules.
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<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">'ISqu':<br><blockquote class=3D"gmai=
l_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left=
:1ex;">Clear cases:<br>
<br>
{tuj} =96 n. heat<br>
<br>
=A0=A0 Their anger so hot,<br>
=A0=A0=A0=A0 It could melt the rock<br>
=A0=A0 tujqu'choHmo' QeHchaj<br>
=A0=A0=A0=A0 nagh tetlaH tujvam<br>
=A0=A0 (pp 76-77)<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>This isn't a new =
word. =A0It's on TKD p. 110/136. :-)</div><div>=A0</div><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;pa=
dding-left:1ex;">
{puj} =96 n. weakness<br>
<br>
=A0=A0 United to do battle together!<br>
=A0=A0 Against fear and against weakness!<br>
=A0=A0 SuvvIpghach puj je<br>
=A0=A0 HarghmeH yeq chaH<br>
=A0=A0 (pp 118-119)<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>The entire line rea=
ds:</div><div>=A0 =A0 nItebHa' molor HI''a'</div><div>=A0 =
=A0 =A0 =A0 SuvvIpghach puj je</div><div>=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 HarghmeH yeq chaH<=
/div><div>=A0</div><div>
I read {puj} as an adjective here when I first read it {SuvvIpghach puj} &q=
uot;weak fear of fighting", and read the {je} as connecting that and {=
molor HI''a'}. =A0It's not an impossible reading, though=A0=
{SuvvIpghach puj} is a very confusing term. =A0You're probably right th=
at {puj} is a noun here.</div>
<div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex=
;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">{ghom} =96 n. assembly<br>
<br>
=A0=A0 SIqral bIQtIq ghom<br>
=A0=A0 Assembly at the River Skral<br>
=A0=A0 (pp 140-141, 202-203)<br>
<br>
=A0 =A0 The word cannot be a verb because then the line would mean<br>
=A0=A0 "They meet the River Skral", which doesn't make sense =
in the<br>
=A0=A0 light of what happens in the book.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><d=
iv>Again, {ghom} was already known as a noun. =A0 It's given as "g=
roup, party" in TKD p. 86, 135 and as "band, group, part" in=
KGT p. 214. =A0"Assembly" is just another English translation of=
the same concept.</div>
<div>=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;=
border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">[... poD ...]<br>
All of these are titles of specific cantos with the exception of {ngaS},<br=
>
which can also be considered as a type of heading naming a section in a<br>
book.=A0</blockquote><div><br></div><div>The sections of the book are calle=
d {paq'yav}, {paq'raD}, and {paq'QIH}. =A0{yav} and {QIH} exist=
as nouns, but {raD} is a verb only (AFAIK). =A0But perhaps book or chapter=
titles do not follow normal grammatical rules. =A0</div>
<div>=A0</div></div>-- <br>De'vID<br>
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