[87767] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: choH vs. choHmoH
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (=?UTF-8?B?QW5kcsOpIE3DvGxsZXI=?=)
Sat Jan 30 22:51:17 2010
In-Reply-To: <76a2c5b51001301940u61b49b12qe05b0ff2706b5eff@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 04:49:44 +0100
From: =?UTF-8?B?QW5kcsOpIE3DvGxsZXI=?= <esperantist@gmail.com>
To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Errors-to: tlhingan-hol-bounce@kli.org
Reply-to: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Facebook is not an activity, it's a website. When you speak about buttons,
people's accounts, user pics, they're clearly presented locally on Facebook.
{-Daq} is very appropriate here.
- André
2010/1/31 Lucas Big-Guy <asdfgh746@gmail.com>
> About the Facebook thing, {-Daq} is locative, Facebook is not a location,
> but an activity.
> L.
> On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 8:14 PM, David Trimboli <david@trimboli.name>
> wrote:
>
> > On 1/30/2010 6:54 PM, André Müller wrote:
> > > 2) I was going through my dictionary to find more {moH}-verbs that
> derive
> > > from transitive ones and I've come across {muv} (join) and {muvmoH}
> > > (recruit). I think, we don't have any canon examples, or do we? Voragh?
> > > I always assumed, {muv} would be transitive, but now I see, this might
> > not
> > > be the case, cause:
> > >
> > > If {muv} would be transitive "to join sth.", then {muvmoH} would mean
> "to
> > > cause to be joined" and its direct object would have to be a group or
> > > society like Starfleet, Facebook or maybe a party. Then the translation
> > that
> > > Okrand gave us, "recruit" would be quite misleading.
> > > If {muv} is intransitive "to join", then {muvmoH} simply means "to
> cause
> > so.
> > > to join". The group or society being joined would have to be expressed
> > with
> > > {-Daq}... or maybe {-vaD}.
> >
> > No, if {muv} means "join something," then my {-moH} theory would work
> > exactly the same as with {ghoj} "learn something."
> >
> > Hol Daghoj
> > you learn the language
> >
> > Hol DaghojmoH
> > you teach the language
> > (you cause a change of condition in which someone unstated learns
> > the language)
> >
> > puqvaD Hol DaghojmoH
> > you teach the child the language
> > (you cause a change of condition, for the benefit of the child, in
> > which someone whose identity contexts tells you is the child learns
> > the language)
> >
> > mangghom Damuv
> > you join the army
> >
> > mangghom DamuvmoH
> > you recruit (someone) into the army
> > (you cause a change of condition in which someone unstated joins the
> > army)
> >
> > ta'vaD mangghom DamuvmoH
> > you recruit (someone) into the army for the Emperor
> > (you cause a change of condition, for the benefit of the emperor, in
> > which someone unstated joins the army)
> >
> > (Notice how {-vaD} didn't fit into a nice, neat, packaged formula here?)
> >
> > > Thus, we made quite a bunch of mistakes in the Klingon translation of
> > > Facebook, there we have:
> > >
> > > Facebook yImuv! = Join Facebook!
> > > FacebookDaq juppu'lI' tImuvmoH! = Invite your friends to join Facebook!
> > >
> > > But now I think it should rather be:
> > >
> > > FacebookDaq yImuv! = Join (in) Facebook!
> > > FacebookDaq juppu'lI' tImuvmoH! = Let your friends join (in) Facebook!
> > > [literally]
> >
> > No, it'd be
> >
> > Facebook yImuv!
> > join Facebook
> >
> > juppu'lI'vaD Facebook yImuvmoH!
> > make your friends join Facebook
> > (for your friends, cause a change in which someone determined by
> > context, obviously your friends, joins Facebook)
> >
> > > Oh my... if that's true, quite a bunch of translations have to be
> > changed.
> >
> > Yes, we've been operating on the "subject causes object to verb"
> > paradigm for a very long time.
> >
> > --
> > SuStel
> > http://www.trimboli.name/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
