[2512] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: resend of Queston
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU)
Wed Jan 12 08:54:46 1994
Reply-To: "Klingon Language List" <tlhIngan-Hol@klingon.East.Sun.COM>
From: nsn@vis.mu.OZ.AU (Nick NICHOLAS)
To: "Klingon Language List" <tlhIngan-Hol@klingon.East.Sun.COM>
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 94 0:52:42 EDT
In-Reply-To: <m0pK3lN-00095fC@idptv>; from "David Barron" at Jan 12, 94 4:29 am
batlh choja', David Barron quv:
=If I wish to say
="These are the things I wnat to see done'
=would it translate as:
=Dochmey ta'lu' 'e' vIlegh vIneHbogh 'oH Dochmeyvam'e'
=??????????
Dear Lord. I suspect most languages on Earth similar to Klingon quite simply
wouldn't translate this at all! [1] You really want things like trace pronouns
for them (these are the things that I want to see *them* done), as happens
in nonstandard English. I can't see this as grammatical. For the relative
clause to have Dochmey as a head, ta'lu', at the least, should have a -bogh.
I really doubt Klingon is the type of language where vIneHbogh can jump
two nested clauses to relativise Dochmey.
I would suggest a way out of this, but I don't have to, since you're
translating the wrong sentence. "These are the things I want to see done" is
simply an emphatic reordering of "I want to see *these* things done"; this
kind of thing is called clefting, and is a commonplace device in English (a
favourite of transformational grammarians for its applicability in syntactic
tests). Thus, for *this* sentence, you need only say:
Dochmey'e' ta'lu' 'e' vIlegh vIneH
[1] Deadset. Some relativisations can't be coped with in some languages, and
that's all that can be said about it. Russian, for example, can offer no
translation for your phrase as is. This even applies in English. Take
"I don't know where the road leads"; this relativises to ?"this is the road
which I don't know where it leads".
== == == == == == == == == == == == == == == == == == == ==
Nick Nicholas, Breather {le'o ko na rivbi fi'inai palci je tolvri danlu}
nsn@krang.vis.mu.oz.au -- Miguel Cervantes tr. Jorge LLambias
