[111296] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Hech
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (SuStel)
Sat Sep 30 05:11:00 2017
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From: SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name>
Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2017 13:40:53 -0400
In-Reply-To: <a3134981-c4c9-205a-be1c-f8695916d8bc@trimboli.name>
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On 9/29/2017 1:23 PM, SuStel wrote:
> On 9/29/2017 1:12 PM, mayqel qunenoS wrote:
>> The verb {Hech} is given as "intend, mean to".
>>
>> However I wonder.. does it always have to have the meaning "mean to" ?
>>
>> For example, can we say:
>>
>> {{juH} vIHechbe'; {jul} vIHech}
>> I didn't mean {juH}, I meant {jul}
>
> Everyone uses it that way, but I'm not so sure. I think the object of
> *Hech* is a thing you intended to happen or to do, not a thing you
> intended to say or write. Saying and writing are things you do, but
> they require their own sentences; the actual content is not something
> you do.
>
> We know that *'e' Hech* is perfectly legal. *Hem tlhIngan Segh 'ej
> maHemtaH 'e' wIHech*/Klingons are a proud race, and we intend to go on
> being proud./ (TKW) There is one other *'e' Hech* example in TKW, and
> no other examples of *Hech* elsewhere at all.
>
> I would expect saying or doing to be /*juH*/*vIghItlh 'e' vIHechbe';
> /juH/ vIghItlh 'e' vIHech.* I'm on the fence whether saying would
> require a sentence-as-object-as-object: /*juH*/*jIjatlh 'e' vIHechbe';
> /jul/ jIjatlh 'e' vIHech* or whether a single word doesn't need to be
> treated as a quotation because it's not exactly a sentence anyway.
>
I do think there are ways to use *Hech* that don't involve *'e'.* Here's
an example:
nablIj wIlajchugh qaS Qugh. nab vIHechbogh jIH wIlajchugh maQapchu'.
--
SuStel
http://trimboli.name
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/29/2017 1:23 PM, SuStel wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:a3134981-c4c9-205a-be1c-f8695916d8bc@trimboli.name">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/29/2017 1:12 PM, mayqel qunenoS
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAP7F2cL23VeZUQkNpefZ9MbhwSDDsAYqZL04WsiAg-82xU-yTw@mail.gmail.com">The
verb {Hech} is given as "intend, mean to".
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">However I wonder.. does it always have to have
the meaning "mean to" ?</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">For example, can we say:</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">{{juH} vIHechbe'; {jul} vIHech}</div>
<div dir="auto">I didn't mean {juH}, I meant {jul}</div>
</blockquote>
<p>Everyone uses it that way, but I'm not so sure. I think the
object of <b>Hech</b> is a thing you intended to happen or to
do, not a thing you intended to say or write. Saying and writing
are things you do, but they require their own sentences; the
actual content is not something you do.</p>
<p>We know that <b>'e' Hech</b> is perfectly legal. <b>Hem
tlhIngan Segh 'ej maHemtaH 'e' wIHech</b><i> Klingons are a
proud race, and we intend to go on being proud.</i> (TKW)
There is one other <b>'e' Hech</b> example in TKW, and no other
examples of <b>Hech</b> elsewhere at all.<br>
</p>
<p>I would expect saying or doing to be <i><b>juH</b></i><b>
vIghItlh 'e' vIHechbe'; <i>juH</i> vIghItlh 'e' vIHech.</b>
I'm on the fence whether saying would require a
sentence-as-object-as-object: <i><b>juH</b></i><b> jIjatlh 'e'
vIHechbe'; <i>jul</i> jIjatlh 'e' vIHech</b> or whether a
single word doesn't need to be treated as a quotation because
it's not exactly a sentence anyway.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I do think there are ways to use <b>Hech</b> that don't involve
<b>'e'.</b> Here's an example:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>nablIj wIlajchugh qaS Qugh. nab vIHechbogh jIH wIlajchugh
maQapchu'.<br>
</p>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
SuStel
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://trimboli.name">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
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