[110817] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] With "joq" - how do we choose the right verb
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (nIqolay Q)
Thu Aug 31 17:31:09 2017
X-Original-To: tlhingan-hol@lists.kli.org
In-Reply-To: <CAEr0j+SrUiWoHQK06_d-sQHSB=Ex2JjTX3ahiv6-UH+7ssGiLQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: nIqolay Q <niqolay0@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2017 13:54:24 -0400
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Reply-To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@lists.kli.org
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I don't think the plurality of phrases with {joq} or {ghap} has ever been
discussed. I don't know if there's any examples. My guess is that since
{joq} also includes the idea of "and", it should be considered plural. But
that's just a guess, and I have no idea what to do with {ghap}, or what to
do with the broader question of unknown plurality. We may have to kick this
one over to Maltz.
On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 12:56 PM, Aur=C3=A9lie Demonchaux <
demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> While discussing on the "Learn Klingon" group on Facebook, we wondered ho=
w
> to choose the correct verb prefix when "joq" (and / or) is used in the
> object and / or subject of the sentence.
>
> If we have the structure:
>
> noun1 noun2 joq + verb
>
> Do we consider that the object of the verb is singular or plural ?
>
> Using an example sentence: We need to learn French and / or Klingon.
>
> 1/ vIraS Hol tlhIngan Hol joq *wI*ghojnIS.
> 2/ vIraS Hol tlhIngan Hol joq *DI*ghojnIS
>
> if it were just a "je" we'd use "DI-" without hesitating, or if it were a
> "ghap" we'd use "wI-", but with joq... ?
>
> Has it already been discussed at some point what to do when you can't
> determine whether a verb's object / subject is singular or plural ?
>
> Thanks in advance :)
> Aur=C3=A9lie
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> tlhIngan-Hol mailing list
> tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org
> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
>
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr">I don't think the plurality of phrases with {joq} or {=
ghap} has ever been discussed. I don't know if there's any examples=
. My guess is that since {joq} also includes the idea of "and", i=
t should be considered plural. But that's just a guess, and I have no i=
dea what to do with {ghap}, or what to do with the broader question of unkn=
own plurality. We may have to kick this one over to Maltz.<br><div class=3D=
"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 12:56 =
PM, Aur=C3=A9lie Demonchaux <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:demonch=
aux.aurelie@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com</a>&g=
t;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0=
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Hell=
o all,</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helveti=
ca,sans-serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:=
arial,helvetica,sans-serif">While discussing on the "Learn Klingon&quo=
t; group on Facebook, we wondered how to choose the correct verb prefix whe=
n "joq" (and / or) is used in the object and / or subject of the =
sentence.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:aria=
l,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"fon=
t-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If we have the structure:=C2=A0</div><=
div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif=
"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helveti=
ca,sans-serif">noun1 noun2 joq + verb</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" sty=
le=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail=
_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do we consider t=
hat the object of the verb is singular or plural ?</div><div class=3D"gmail=
_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div c=
lass=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Usi=
ng an example sentence: We need to learn French and / or Klingon.</div><div=
class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><=
br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,=
sans-serif">1/ vIraS Hol tlhIngan Hol joq <b>wI</b>ghojnIS.</div><div class=
=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">2/ vIra=
S Hol tlhIngan Hol joq <b>DI</b>ghojnIS</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" s=
tyle=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gma=
il_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">if it were jus=
t a "je" we'd use "DI-" without hesitating, or if i=
t were a "ghap" we'd use "wI-", but with joq... ?</=
div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-=
serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,he=
lvetica,sans-serif">Has it already been discussed at some point what to do =
when you can't determine whether a verb's object / subject is singu=
lar or plural ?</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:aria=
l,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"fon=
t-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Thanks in advance :)</div><span class=
=3D"m_7950277953104494254HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><div class=3D"gmai=
l_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Aur=C3=A9lie</d=
iv><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-s=
erif"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,hel=
vetica,sans-serif"><br></div></font></span></div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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