[102775] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] KLBC: Due to the refusal, the topic is forgotten
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (fata irae)
Wed Dec 2 20:08:35 2015
In-Reply-To: <CAOJo7ioMigDT7O12pUF6HuHZAkWjd6P8i8E6eiGoHUuxr0S2dg@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2015 20:08:16 -0500
From: fata irae <fatairae@gmail.com>
To: tlhIngan-Hol <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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Rohan
| I think I see whats going on - using the topic as kind of a vocative
statement...
Yes, vocative is exactly what I was going for. Always thought it was a
little funny in Latin and Sanskrit when translated as "Oh X!", but helps
with directed addressing. I'll have to remember {'o}.
Rohan
| In imperatives of adjectival verbs like {HoS} "be strong" ... its
unidiomatic to say ... that Klingons normally add {-'eghmoH} "cause onself
to" ...
Interestingly, this brings up another point that I was wrestling with
earlier today, with what Ive been calling state verbs in my head, and how
they seem to act differently then the others. But I'll save that for
another topic.
In particular, I guess I was trying to do the opposite of -moH with
adjectival verbs, and make a regular verb a state.
tujmoH ~ to heat, make be hot
lIjlu' ~ be forgotten, -> yIlIjlu' ~ you be forgotten, -> yIlIjbe'lu' ~
you be not forgotten!, you not be in the state of being forgotten!
De'vID
| What does this even mean? How can you give a command to someone not to be
forgotten by someone else?
Ahh, but thats the point (or so it went in my head). The command is to not
be in the state of being forgotten (by nebulous others), somewhat evocative
of calling upon muses (thus as Rohan pointed out, the vocative would work
perfect).
| {DalIjbe'lu'meH yIvang!} "act, ...
Yes, a direct command of what to do would be simpler, and avoid the muddy
indirection's, though not give the exact tone I was going for. Thank you
for pointing that out. I'll have to figure out a way of either
incorporating the yearning on the part of the "someones", or rethink the
psychology behind the statement.
perhaps even:
yIlIjbe'eghmoHlu' ~ Cause yourself to not be forgotten! ?
(or would a double reversal lead us back to the beginning, like a mad rats
maze?)
So back to the original point, using -lu' as a mirror of -moH (somewhat).
Is there another way to do that, for verbs that don't have a mirroring
state word?
Thanks all for the comments.
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div>Roh=
an<br></div>| I think I see whats going on - using the topic as kind of a v=
ocative statement...<br></div>Yes, vocative is exactly what I was going for=
.=C2=A0 Always thought it was a little funny in Latin and Sanskrit when tra=
nslated as "Oh X!", but helps with directed addressing.=C2=A0 I&#=
39;ll have to remember {'o}.<br><br></div>Rohan<br></div>| In imperativ=
es of adjectival verbs like {HoS} "be strong" ... its unidiomatic=
to say ... that Klingons normally add {-'eghmoH} "cause onself to=
" ...<br></div>Interestingly, this brings up another point that I was =
wrestling with earlier today, with what Ive been calling state verbs in my =
head, and how they seem to act differently then the others.=C2=A0 But I'=
;ll save that for another topic.<br></div>=C2=A0 In particular, I guess I w=
as trying to do the opposite of -moH with adjectival verbs, and make a regu=
lar verb a state.<br>=C2=A0 tujmoH ~ to heat, make be hot<br></div>=C2=A0 l=
Ijlu' ~ be forgotten, -> yIlIjlu' ~ you be forgotten, -> yIlI=
jbe'lu' ~ you be not forgotten!, you not be in the state of being f=
orgotten!</div><div><br></div>De'vID<br></div>| What does this even mea=
n? How can you give a command to someone not to be forgotten by someone els=
e?<br></div>Ahh, but thats the point (or so it went in my head).=C2=A0 The =
command is to not be in the state of being forgotten (by nebulous others), =
somewhat evocative of calling upon muses (thus as Rohan pointed out, the vo=
cative would work perfect).<br></div><div>| {DalIjbe'lu'meH yIvang!=
} "act, ...<br></div><div>Yes, a direct command of what to do would be=
simpler, and avoid the muddy indirection's, though not give the exact =
tone I was going for.=C2=A0 Thank you for pointing that out.=C2=A0 I'll=
have to figure out a way of either incorporating the yearning on the part =
of the "someones", or rethink the psychology behind the statement=
.<br><br><div>perhaps even:<br></div>=C2=A0 yIlIjbe'eghmoHlu' ~ Cau=
se yourself to not be forgotten! ?<br></div><div>(or would a double reversa=
l lead us back to the beginning, like a mad rats maze?)<br></div><div><br><=
/div><div>So back to the original point, using -lu' as a mirror of -moH=
(somewhat).=C2=A0 Is there another way to do that, for verbs that don'=
t have a mirroring state word?<br><br></div><div>Thanks all for the comment=
s.<br></div><div><div><div><div>=C2=A0 <br><div>=C2=A0 <br><div><br></div><=
/div></div></div></div></div></div>
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