[102137] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Concerning the purpose clauses
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (qunnoQ HoD)
Tue Nov 10 07:47:07 2015
In-Reply-To: <767A96EB-ED44-42EC-87F5-6A69B2D0A954@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2015 14:46:51 +0200
From: qunnoQ HoD <mihkoun@gmail.com>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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> When you are very confused about a sentence and cannot really figure out
the structure, try reading it from the end. That works pretty well. Maybe
that helps you.
this is indeed a great idea. i have utilized this way of translating,which
actually works well. at least as long as the sentence is a simple
one,because if it isn't then things start going south no matter what i do..
> As the sentence from TKD says, it is the noun or verb immediately after
the {-meH} clause. {ja'chuqmeH rojHom} means "a truce in order to
discuss". {ja'chuqmeH neH} means "he wants it in order to discuss". Of
course, it gets > a little more confusing when the verb that follows has an
object. Since that object must preceed the verb, it appears immediately
after the {-meH} clause and you are stuck trying to decide if it is
modifying the noun or the verb.
YES ! THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT IS HAPPENING !
..anyway,because i still have trouble assimilating the {-meH}, i would like
to write some sentences so that through the corrections (which hopefully
will follow) i will finally come to understand.
we painted the targh in yellow paint in order to see it
targh wIleghmeH ghah rItlh SuD wIngoH
i tickled my dog to anger it
Ha'DIbaH vIQeHmeH ghah vIqotlh
they destroyed the vessel to anger the commander
la' luQeHmeH DuJ luQaw'
i gave the commander food to get a shore leave
leSpoH vISuqmeH Soj la' vInob
she cloaked her vessel to avoid me
mujunmeH DujDaj So'
he made his bed in order to sleep
QongmeH QongDaqDaj chenmoH
you took away my shoes in order to delay me
chomImmeH waqmeywIj Dange'
he repaired his vessel for the purpose of attacking the ferengi
verenganpu' HIvmeH DujDaj tI'
they skinned the targh in order to make clothes
Sutmey chenmoHmeH targh luSurgh
i gave the female commander vegetation to go on a date
poH vIjaHmeH tI be' la' vInob
cpt qunnoQ
On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Will Martin <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Thanks that helps. Also, I withdraw my =E2=80=9Cproblem=E2=80=9D with {va=
j}, since it=E2=80=99s
> not a conjunction. The other clause is dependent. It=E2=80=99s just an ad=
verbial.
>
> I wish I had the time and/or wisdom to write with less noise and more
> signal.
>
> pItlh
> lojmIt tI'wI'nuv
>
>
>
> On Nov 9, 2015, at 3:20 PM, Alan Anderson <qunchuy@alcaco.net> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Will Martin <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Okay, there=E2=80=99s a verb {yay=E2=80=99} that doesn=E2=80=99t seem app=
ropriate here, so I=E2=80=99m not
> suspecting a misspelling by omitting the glottal stop, and there=E2=80=99=
s a noun
> {yay}, which can=E2=80=99t take a verb suffix {-meH}, so SOMEBODY either =
made a
> mistake here, or there=E2=80=99s canon vocabulary I haven=E2=80=99t found=
yet.
>
>
> Without access to my copy of the text, I'm only guessing, but I think
> the verb should be {yaj}.
>
> -- ghunchu'wI'
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br>> When you are very confused about a sentence =
and cannot really figure out the structure, try reading it from the end. Th=
at works pretty well. Maybe that helps you.<br><br>this is indeed a great i=
dea. i have utilized this way of translating,which actually works well. at =
least as long as the sentence is a simple one,because if it isn't then =
things start going south no matter what i do..<br><br>> As the sentence =
from TKD says, it is the noun or verb immediately after the {-meH} clause.=
=C2=A0 {ja'chuqmeH rojHom} means "a truce in order to discuss"=
;.=C2=A0 {ja'chuqmeH neH} means "he wants it in order to discuss&q=
uot;.=C2=A0 Of course, it gets > a little more confusing when the verb t=
hat follows has an object.=C2=A0 Since that object must preceed the verb, i=
t appears immediately after the {-meH} clause and you are stuck trying to d=
ecide if it is modifying the noun or the verb.<br><br>YES ! THAT'S EXAC=
TLY WHAT IS HAPPENING !<br><br>..anyway,because i still have trouble assimi=
lating the {-meH}, i would like to write some sentences so that through the=
corrections (which hopefully will follow) i will finally come to understan=
d.<br><br>we painted the targh in yellow paint in order to see it<br>targh =
wIleghmeH ghah rItlh SuD wIngoH<br><br>i tickled my dog to anger it<br>Ha&#=
39;DIbaH vIQeHmeH ghah vIqotlh<br><br>they destroyed the vessel to anger th=
e commander<br>la' luQeHmeH DuJ luQaw'<br><br>i gave the commander =
food to get a shore leave<br>leSpoH vISuqmeH Soj la' vInob<br><br>she c=
loaked her vessel to avoid me<br>mujunmeH DujDaj So'<br><br>he made his=
bed in order to sleep<br>QongmeH QongDaqDaj chenmoH<br><br>you took away m=
y shoes in order to delay me<br>chomImmeH waqmeywIj Dange'<br><br>he re=
paired his vessel for the purpose of attacking the ferengi<br>verenganpu=
9; HIvmeH DujDaj tI'<br><br>they skinned the targh in order to make clo=
thes<br>Sutmey chenmoHmeH targh luSurgh<br><br>i gave the female commander =
vegetation to go on a date<br>poH vIjaHmeH tI be' la' vInob<br><br>=
<br></div>cpt qunnoQ<br><div><br><br><br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_ex=
tra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 10:26 PM, Will M=
artin <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc s=
olid;padding-left:1ex"><div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div>Thanks that=
helps. Also, I withdraw my =E2=80=9Cproblem=E2=80=9D with {vaj}, since it=
=E2=80=99s not a conjunction. The other clause is dependent. It=E2=80=99s j=
ust an adverbial.</div><div><br></div><div>I wish I had the time and/or wis=
dom to write with less noise and more signal.</div><span class=3D""><br><di=
v>
<span style=3D"border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvet=
ica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing=
:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-tra=
nsform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div>pItlh</div><div>lojmI=
t tI'wI'nuv</div><div><br></div></span><br>
</div>
<br></span><div><div class=3D"h5"><div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>On No=
v 9, 2015, at 3:20 PM, Alan Anderson <<a href=3D"mailto:qunchuy@alcaco.n=
et" target=3D"_blank">qunchuy@alcaco.net</a>> wrote:</div><br><div>On Mo=
n, Nov 9, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Will Martin <<a href=3D"mailto:lojmitti7wi7nu=
v@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>=
<blockquote type=3D"cite">Okay, there=E2=80=99s a verb {yay=E2=80=99} that =
doesn=E2=80=99t seem appropriate here, so I=E2=80=99m not<br>suspecting a m=
isspelling by omitting the glottal stop, and there=E2=80=99s a noun<br>{yay=
}, which can=E2=80=99t take a verb suffix {-meH}, so SOMEBODY either made a=
<br>mistake here, or there=E2=80=99s canon vocabulary I haven=E2=80=99t fou=
nd yet.<br></blockquote><br>Without access to my copy of the text, I'm =
only guessing, but I think<br>the verb should be {yaj}.<br><br>-- ghunchu&#=
39;wI'<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Tlhing=
an-hol mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br><a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/li=
stinfo/tlhingan-hol" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo=
/tlhingan-hol</a><br></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div><br>___=
____________________________________________<br>
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rrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</=
a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
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