[101653] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Things missing
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (qunnoQ HoD)
Thu Oct 29 15:14:45 2015
In-Reply-To: <00b201d11270$03888210$0a998630$@flyingstart.ca>
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2015 21:14:31 +0200
From: qunnoQ HoD <mihkoun@gmail.com>
To: Robyn Stewart <robyn@flyingstart.ca>
Cc: tlhIngan Hol mailing list <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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> I=E2=80=99m going to make an aside here because the rest of the list may =
not know
that qunnoQ is working very hard on the language, already working on
memorizing the prefix table, writing sentences, reading TKD and are
striving for the next level in EVERY direction, not just asking the big but
easy questions that newcomers ask.
thank you very much Qov !
> I am so delighted by the influx of new people onto this list and working
through the online course, and I hope you are not discouraged by anything.
there is no way i could be discouraged. i love Klingon too much to quit.
besides i'm a capricorn ; and capricorns are well-known for their
persistence towards achieving their goals. the harder it gets,the harder we
try..
> And that=E2=80=99s why we love you.
again thank you for your kind words. as i've written before i'm very happy
to have found this list ; you've all been very helpful,and i would be
ungrateful not to acknowledge that. this is one of the reasons why i try
hard,so that the day will come when i will be able to write here in
Klingon. i feel that i owe it,to those who will have taken the time to help
me.
> If you want "perfect" work on Vulcan.
actually i had checked out vulcan,romulan,the black tongue of
mordor,romulan and quenya before Klingon. I didn't even start learning any
of them,each for different reasons. But that would be the subject of
another thread..
> It's more like plastic surgery. If after knowing someone for a very
short time, you suddenly said, "Why don't you have your nose straightened?
And your tummy bulge cut out? And your chin tucked? And your boobs
reduced?" It's insulting and indicates a fundamental misunderstanding of
what makes them who they are.
hmm.. i hadn't thought of it this way ! it was certainly not my intention
to mean anything like that. Anyway,point taken.
qunnoQ
On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 7:34 PM, Robyn Stewart <robyn@flyingstart.ca> wrote=
:
> jatlh qunnoQ HoD:
>
> > How would you measure though how much [someone] likes [tlhngan Hol] ?
> how passionate he is about it ? how much he wants to learn it ? is there =
a
> test ? a way to find out ?
>
> That has been the test of time and dedication. Actually speaks the
> language: committed and passionate. Argues about the corners of it witho=
ut
> actually speaking it: involved, but ...? Not everyone has the linguistic
> talent or memory to learn the language to fluency, but the years and hour=
s
> people put into promoting the language, making it accessible, coordinatin=
g
> projects, and running qep=E2=80=99a=E2=80=99mey or qepHommey show their p=
assion.
>
> I=E2=80=99m going to make an aside here because the rest of the list may =
not know
> that qunnoQ is working very hard on the language, already working on
> memorizing the prefix table, writing sentences, reading TKD and are
> striving for the next level in EVERY direction, not just asking the big b=
ut
> easy questions that newcomers ask. There=E2=80=99s a reflex on the list t=
o say,
> with varying degrees of politeness, =E2=80=9Cshut up and learn the langua=
ge before
> you question it.=E2=80=9D It=E2=80=99s because questions often come from=
people who
> haven=E2=80=99t taken the time to appreciate tlhIngan Hol, or to apprecia=
te the fun
> of saying what needs to be said with the tools that are available.
>
> > Your knowledge is a part of you,and it cannot be separated from you.
> Ever. Furthermore education comes as an irreversible process which change=
s
> you -irreversebly too-. You can't unlearn what you have already learned.
>
> There is a Klingonist who has had semi-permanent body modification to
> create forehead ridges. It made me pose the question to myself, =E2=80=
=9Cwhy do I
> think that is more startling than the fact that I have permanently change=
d
> the INSIDE of my brain with this language?=E2=80=9D While many people ri=
dicule us
> for learning Klingon, it=E2=80=99s the time spent or how they perceive ou=
r
> priorities that they are mocking, not the fact that our brains are now
> different. But I love it. I love this language, and that=E2=80=99s why =
I=E2=80=99m
> working to ensure that there will continue to be people who speak it. I =
am
> so delighted by the influx of new people onto this list and working throu=
gh
> the online course, and I hope you are not discouraged by anything.
>
> > so,because i love Klingon and because it is becoming/will eventually
> become one of the languages i speak,because it is becoming a part of myse=
lf
> i want/demand/accept
> > nothing else than for it to be perfect. Its as simple as that.
>
> And that=E2=80=99s why we love you.
>
> As I said in another thread, Marc says he has it handled, and I=E2=80=99m=
not in
> any hurry to find out what his succession plan is. I imagine by then you=
=E2=80=99ll
> be an accomplished speaker, and will be part of that solution. vaj DaH
> yIghojqu=E2=80=99.
>
> - Qov
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 3:27 PM, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
>
> On 10/29/2015 2:16 AM, Tim Stoffel wrote:
>
> Considering what the Klingon language community has accomplished over
> the years, it would be a shame to think that the end of Marc Okrand
> (which I hope is no time soon!) could be the end of the Klingon
> language.
>
> We need a mechanism to keep the language alive.
>
>
> Such a mechanism can be dreamed up at such time as Okrand leaves us or
> decides not to do Klingon anymore. Why try to impose it now? The language
> won't suddenly evaporate when he's gone.
>
> --
> SuStel
> http://trimboli.name
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br>> I=E2=80=99m going to make an aside here beca=
use the rest of the list may not know that qunnoQ is working very hard on t=
he language, already working on memorizing the prefix table, writing senten=
ces, reading TKD and are striving for the next level in EVERY direction, no=
t just asking the big but easy questions that newcomers ask.<br><br>thank y=
ou very much Qov !<br><br>>=C2=A0 I am so delighted by the influx of new=
people onto this list and working through the online course, and I hope yo=
u are not discouraged by anything.<br><br>there is no way i could be discou=
raged. i love Klingon too much to quit. besides i'm a capricorn ; and c=
apricorns are well-known for their persistence towards achieving their goal=
s. the harder it gets,the harder we try..<br><br>> And that=E2=80=99s wh=
y we love you.<br><br>again thank you for your kind words. as i've writ=
ten before i'm very happy to have found this list ; you've all been=
very helpful,and i would be ungrateful not to acknowledge that. this is on=
e of the reasons why i try hard,so that the day will come when i will be ab=
le to write here in Klingon. i feel that i owe it,to those who will have ta=
ken the time to help me.<br><br>> If you want "perfect" work o=
n Vulcan.<br><br></div>actually i had checked out vulcan,romulan,the black =
tongue of mordor,romulan and quenya before Klingon. I didn't even start=
learning any of them,each for different reasons. But that would be the sub=
ject of another thread..<br><div><br>> It's more like plastic surger=
y.=C2=A0 If after knowing someone for a very short time, you suddenly said,=
"Why don't you have your nose straightened?=C2=A0 And your tummy =
bulge cut out?=C2=A0 And your chin tucked?=C2=A0 And your boobs reduced?&qu=
ot; =C2=A0It's insulting and indicates a fundamental misunderstanding o=
f what makes them who they are.<br><br>hmm.. i hadn't thought of it thi=
s way ! it was certainly not my intention to mean anything like that. Anywa=
y,point taken.<br><br>qunnoQ<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br>=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 7:34 PM, Robyn Stewart <=
span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:robyn@flyingstart.ca" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robyn@flyingstart.ca</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmai=
l_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left=
:1ex"><div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-CA"><div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"=
>jatlh qunnoQ HoD:<br><br>> How</span> would you measure though how much=
<span style=3D"color:#1f497d">[someone]</span> likes <span style=3D"color:=
#1f497d">[tlhngan Hol]</span> ? how passionate he is about it ? how much he=
wants to learn it ? is there a test ? a way to find out ? <span style=3D"c=
olor:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"marg=
in-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri=
","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">That has been the test of time=
and dedication.=C2=A0 Actually speaks the language: committed and passiona=
te.=C2=A0 Argues about the corners of it without actually speaking it: invo=
lved, but ...? Not everyone has the linguistic=C2=A0 talent or memory to le=
arn the language to fluency, but the years and hours people put into promot=
ing the language, making it accessible, coordinating projects, and running =
qep=E2=80=99a=E2=80=99mey or qepHommey show their passion.<br><br>I=E2=80=
=99m going to make an aside here because the rest of the list may not know =
that qunnoQ is working very hard on the language, already working on memori=
zing the prefix table, writing sentences, reading TKD and are striving for =
the next level in EVERY direction, not just asking the big but easy questio=
ns that newcomers ask. There=E2=80=99s a reflex on the list to say, with va=
rying degrees of politeness, =E2=80=9Cshut up and learn the language before=
you question it.=E2=80=9D =C2=A0It=E2=80=99s because questions often come =
from people who haven=E2=80=99t taken the time to appreciate tlhIngan Hol, =
or to appreciate the fun of saying what needs to be said with the tools tha=
t are available.=C2=A0 <u></u><u></u></span></p><span class=3D""><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"=
>> </span>Your knowledge is a part of you,and it cannot be separated fro=
m you. Ever. Furthermore education comes as an irreversible process which c=
hanges you -irreversebly too-. You can't unlearn what you have already =
learned.<span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p></span><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:1=
1.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"=
>There is a Klingonist who has had semi-permanent body modification to crea=
te forehead ridges.=C2=A0 It made me pose the question to myself, =E2=80=9C=
why do I think that is more startling than the fact that I have permanently=
changed the INSIDE of my brain with this language?=E2=80=9D=C2=A0 While ma=
ny people ridicule us for learning Klingon, it=E2=80=99s the time spent or =
how they perceive our =C2=A0priorities that they are mocking, not the fact =
that our brains are now different.=C2=A0 But I love it.=C2=A0 I love this l=
anguage, and that=E2=80=99s why I=E2=80=99m working to ensure that there wi=
ll continue to be people who speak it.=C2=A0 I am so delighted by the influ=
x of new people onto this list and working through the online course, and I=
hope you are not discouraged by anything.<u></u><u></u></span></p><span cl=
ass=3D""><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=
=3D"color:#1f497d">> </span>so,because i love Klingon and because it is =
becoming/will eventually become one of the languages i speak,because it is =
becoming a part of myself i want/demand/accept <span style=3D"color:#1f497d=
"><br>> </span>nothing else than for it to be perfect. Its as simple as =
that.<span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p></span><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">An=
d that=E2=80=99s why we love you. <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">As I sa=
id in another thread, Marc says he has it handled, and I=E2=80=99m not in a=
ny hurry to find out what his succession plan is. I imagine by then you=E2=
=80=99ll be an accomplished speaker, and will be part of that solution. vaj=
DaH yIghojqu=E2=80=99.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" styl=
e=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">- Qov</span><br><b=
r><br><u></u><u></u></p></div><span class=3D""><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at=
3:27 PM, SuStel <<a href=3D"mailto:sustel@trimboli.name" target=3D"_bla=
nk">sustel@trimboli.name</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal">On 10/29/2015 2:16 AM, Tim Stoffel wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal">Considering what the Klingon language community has accomplishe=
d over<br>the years, it would be a shame to think that the end of Marc Okra=
nd<br>(which I hope is no time soon!) could be the end of the Klingon<br>la=
nguage.<br><br>We need a mechanism to keep the language alive.<u></u><u></u=
></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>Such a mechanism can be dreamed up at such =
time as Okrand leaves us or decides not to do Klingon anymore. Why try to i=
mpose it now? The language won't suddenly evaporate when he's gone.=
<span style=3D"color:#888888"><br><br><span>-- </span><br><span>SuStel</spa=
n><br><span><a href=3D"http://trimboli.name" target=3D"_blank">http://trimb=
oli.name</a></span></span><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Tlhingan-hol m=
ailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org" target=3D"_blank">Tl=
hingan-hol@kli.org</a><br><a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/t=
lhingan-hol" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhinga=
n-hol</a><u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></span></div></div><br>_____________________________=
__________________<br>
Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" rel=3D"norefe=
rrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</=
a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
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