[101511] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] qaghwI' between consonants
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (qunnoQ HoD)
Mon Oct 26 10:21:21 2015
In-Reply-To: <5D62D26B-142F-44A2-BE31-69F3EE17F317@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2015 16:21:04 +0200
From: qunnoQ HoD <mihkoun@gmail.com>
To: "lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh" <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
Cc: "tlhingan-hol@stodi.digitalkingdom.org"
<tlhingan-hol@stodi.digitalkingdom.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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> I hope this is helpful
yes it is ! thanks !
On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 2:18 AM, lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh <
lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com> wrote:
> In HolQeD, The Journal of the Klingon Language Institute (no longer
> published), Volume 1, Number 1, March, 1992, in the first article, Lawren=
ce
> M. Schoen wrote an article on the difference between tlhIngan Hol vs.
> klingonaase, the latter being the source of a lot of these impossible
> pronunciations. In the second article in the same volume, Allan C. Wechsl=
er
> wrote under the title =E2=80=9CFirst Steps Towards a Phonological Theory =
of
> Klingon=E2=80=9D the author gives great detail (four pages of text) talki=
ng about
> the nature of the sounds used in the Klingon language before getting to t=
he
> subtopic =E2=80=9CThe syllable structure of Klingon=E2=80=9D.
>
> What follows may be drinking from a fire hose for some people, but it=E2=
=80=99s
> just a small outtake from an 8 page article.
>
> =E2=80=9CThe vast majority of Klingon syllables have the shape CVC [Conso=
nant,
> Vowel, Consonant]. We will therefore, speak of the C1 and C2 of a typical
> syllable. There are also a number of syllables with the variant shape CV;
> we will regard these has having a null C2. No syllable has a null C1.=E2=
=80=9D
>
> =E2=80=9CAll the consonants of Klingon occur both as C1 and as C2. Furthe=
rmore,
> all possible C1-V combinations actually occur, as do all possible V-C2
> combinations except */uw/ and */ow/ (see above for a possible explanation
> of this gap). Thus, there are no obvious contact constraints. Klingon doe=
s
> not appear to have any conditioned assimilations or other phonological
> rules. Almost no consonant clusters are permitted within syllables, but I
> discuss some anomalies below.
>
> =E2=80=9CThe distribution of open syllables=E2=80=9D
>
> =E2=80=9CThe open syllables (those with null C2) show an interesting sema=
ntic
> pattern, which is worthy of mention because Klingon has almost no semanti=
c
> component below the level of the syllable. With exactly one known
> exception, Klingon has no morphemes smaller than a syllable. (The excepti=
on
> is the position-1 noun suffix /-oy/ =E2=80=9Cendearment=E2=80=9D). Theref=
ore, it is
> interesting that lack of C2 should have any particular semantic
> significance.=E2=80=9D
>
> =E2=80=9CEvery single one of the 23 pronominal verb prefixes has CV shape=
. CV
> syllables are quite rare elsewhere in the language. There are a dozen or =
so
> open monosyllabic noun stems (e.g. /po/ =E2=80=9Cmorning=E2=80=9D), a few=
recent loan words
> that brought open syllables into the language from outside (e.g. /tera=E2=
=80=99/
> =E2=80=9CEarth=E2=80=9D) and a handful of native disyllables, all of the =
shape CV-CVC, and
> all nouns or adverbs of opaque derivation (e.g. /DIvI=E2=80=99/ =E2=80=9C=
federation",
> /nIteb/ =E2=80=9Calone=E2=80=9D). In addition there is exactly one known =
open monosyllabic
> verb stem, /Da/ =E2=80=9Cact in the manner of=E2=80=9D.
>
> It goes on for several more pages before getting to =E2=80=9CAnomalous sy=
llables=E2=80=9D:
>
> =E2=80=9CKlingon possesses two kinds of anomalous syllables that do not f=
it the
> prevailing CV(C) pattern. The first exceptional pattern is /CVrgh/.
> Apparently, /rgh/ can function as C2 without restriction; in multisyllabi=
c
> words this can lead to CCC sequences at syllable boundaries. An example i=
s
> /burghDaj/ =E2=80=9Cher stomach=E2=80=9D.
>
> =E2=80=A6 =E2=80=9CFor all practical purposes, /-rgh/ functions as a sing=
le segment. The
> most straightforward approach is to analyze it exactly that way: as a
> single complex segment, only appearing in syllable-final position (like t=
he
> dorso-velar nasal /ng/ in English).=E2=80=9D
>
> =E2=80=A6 =E2=80=9CThe other anomalous syllable shape is CVY=E2=80=99, wh=
ere Y represents either
> of the glides /w/ and /y/. The occurring rimes in this category are:
>
> =E2=80=94 =E2=80=94 uy=E2=80=99 =E2=80=94
> ey =E2=80=94 oy=E2=80=99 =E2=80=94
> ay=E2=80=99 aw=E2=80=99
>
> where the hyphens show =E2=80=9Cmissing=E2=80=9D rimes which do not occur=
in the
> (available) lexicon. =E2=80=9C
>
> [end quote]
>
> He goes on for another half page explaining the missing =E2=80=9Crimes=E2=
=80=9D.
>
> I hope this is helpful.
>
> lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =E2=80=98utlh
> Door Repair Guy, Retired Honorably
>
>
>
> > On Oct 24, 2015, at 1:39 PM, Lieven <levinius@gmx.de> wrote:
> >
> >> > is there a list somewhere of consonant clusters
> >> > allowed/disallowed in tlhingan phonology?
> >
> > jang loghaD:
> >> Not to the best of my knowledge;
> >
> > At least not in any canon source. Dont't forget the Klingon wiki, which
> I recommend for beginners to browse, as it answers lots of questions:
> >
> > http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/ConsonantCluster
> > http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/Phonology
> >
> >> 4) Non-Klingon names have been known to break the above rules. These
> >> include {jemS} ("James"), {qIrq} ("Kirk") and {pIqarD} ("Picard").
> >
> > And the recently discovered {marq 'oqranD}
> >
> > --
> > Lieven L. Litaer
> > aka Quvar valer 'utlh
> > Grammarian of the KLI
> > http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher
> > http://www.klingonwiki.net
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> > Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> > http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>> I hope this is helpful<br><br></div>yes it is ! =
thanks !<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
>On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 2:18 AM, lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh <span=
dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com" target=3D"_bl=
ank">lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex">In HolQeD, The Journal of the Klingon Language Institute (no =
longer published), Volume 1, Number 1, March, 1992, in the first article, L=
awrence M. Schoen wrote an article on the difference between tlhIngan Hol v=
s. klingonaase, the latter being the source of a lot of these impossible pr=
onunciations. In the second article in the same volume, Allan C. Wechsler w=
rote under the title =E2=80=9CFirst Steps Towards a Phonological Theory of =
Klingon=E2=80=9D the author gives great detail (four pages of text) talking=
about the nature of the sounds used in the Klingon language before getting=
to the subtopic =E2=80=9CThe syllable structure of Klingon=E2=80=9D.<br>
<br>
What follows may be drinking from a fire hose for some people, but it=E2=80=
=99s just a small outtake from an 8 page article.<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CThe vast majority of Klingon syllables have the shape CVC [Consona=
nt, Vowel, Consonant]. We will therefore, speak of the C1 and C2 of a typic=
al syllable. There are also a number of syllables with the variant shape CV=
; we will regard these has having a null C2. No syllable has a null C1.=E2=
=80=9D<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CAll the consonants of Klingon occur both as C1 and as C2. Furtherm=
ore, all possible C1-V combinations actually occur, as do all possible V-C2=
combinations except */uw/ and */ow/ (see above for a possible explanation =
of this gap). Thus, there are no obvious contact constraints. Klingon does =
not appear to have any conditioned assimilations or other phonological rule=
s. Almost no consonant clusters are permitted within syllables, but I discu=
ss some anomalies below.<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CThe distribution of open syllables=E2=80=9D<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CThe open syllables (those with null C2) show an interesting semant=
ic pattern, which is worthy of mention because Klingon has almost no semant=
ic component below the level of the syllable. With exactly one known except=
ion, Klingon has no morphemes smaller than a syllable. (The exception is th=
e position-1 noun suffix /-oy/ =E2=80=9Cendearment=E2=80=9D). Therefore, it=
is interesting that lack of C2 should have any particular semantic signifi=
cance.=E2=80=9D<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CEvery single one of the 23 pronominal verb prefixes has CV shape. =
CV syllables are quite rare elsewhere in the language. There are a dozen or=
so open monosyllabic noun stems (e.g. /po/ =E2=80=9Cmorning=E2=80=9D), a f=
ew recent loan words that brought open syllables into the language from out=
side (e.g. /tera=E2=80=99/ =E2=80=9CEarth=E2=80=9D) and a handful of native=
disyllables, all of the shape CV-CVC, and all nouns or adverbs of opaque d=
erivation (e.g. /DIvI=E2=80=99/ =E2=80=9Cfederation", /nIteb/ =E2=80=
=9Calone=E2=80=9D). In addition there is exactly one known open monosyllabi=
c verb stem, /Da/ =E2=80=9Cact in the manner of=E2=80=9D.<br>
<br>
It goes on for several more pages before getting to =E2=80=9CAnomalous syll=
ables=E2=80=9D:<br>
<br>
=E2=80=9CKlingon possesses two kinds of anomalous syllables that do not fit=
the prevailing CV(C) pattern. The first exceptional pattern is /CVrgh/. Ap=
parently, /rgh/ can function as C2 without restriction; in multisyllabic wo=
rds this can lead to CCC sequences at syllable boundaries. An example is /b=
urghDaj/ =E2=80=9Cher stomach=E2=80=9D.<br>
<br>
=E2=80=A6 =E2=80=9CFor all practical purposes, /-rgh/ functions as a single=
segment. The most straightforward approach is to analyze it exactly that w=
ay: as a single complex segment, only appearing in syllable-final position =
(like the dorso-velar nasal /ng/ in English).=E2=80=9D<br>
<br>
=E2=80=A6 =E2=80=9CThe other anomalous syllable shape is CVY=E2=80=99, wher=
e Y represents either of the glides /w/ and /y/. The occurring rimes in thi=
s category are:<br>
<br>
=E2=80=94 =E2=80=94=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0uy=E2=80=99=C2=A0 =E2=80=94<br>
ey =E2=80=94=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0oy=E2=80=99=C2=A0 =E2=80=94<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0ay=E2=80=99=C2=A0 aw=E2=80=
=99<br>
<br>
where the hyphens show =E2=80=9Cmissing=E2=80=9D rimes which do not occur i=
n the (available) lexicon. =E2=80=9C<br>
<br>
[end quote]<br>
<br>
He goes on for another half page explaining the missing =E2=80=9Crimes=E2=
=80=9D.<br>
<br>
I hope this is helpful.<br>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =E2=80=98utlh<br>
Door Repair Guy, Retired Honorably<br>
</font></span><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
> On Oct 24, 2015, at 1:39 PM, Lieven <<a href=3D"mailto:levinius@gmx=
.de">levinius@gmx.de</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
>> > is there a list somewhere of consonant clusters<br>
>> > allowed/disallowed in tlhingan phonology?<br>
><br>
> jang loghaD:<br>
>>=C2=A0 Not to the best of my knowledge;<br>
><br>
> At least not in any canon source. Dont't forget the Klingon wiki, =
which I recommend for beginners to browse, as it answers lots of questions:=
<br>
><br>
> <a href=3D"http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/ConsonantCluster" rel=3D"nore=
ferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/ConsonantCluster</a=
><br>
> <a href=3D"http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/Phonology" rel=3D"noreferrer"=
target=3D"_blank">http://www.klingonwiki.net/En/Phonology</a><br>
><br>
>> 4) Non-Klingon names have been known to break the above rules. The=
se<br>
>> include {jemS} ("James"), {qIrq} ("Kirk") and =
{pIqarD} ("Picard").<br>
><br>
> And the recently discovered {marq 'oqranD}<br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Lieven L. Litaer<br>
> aka Quvar valer 'utlh<br>
> Grammarian of the KLI<br>
> <a href=3D"http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher" rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher</a><br>
> <a href=3D"http://www.klingonwiki.net" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_b=
lank">http://www.klingonwiki.net</a><br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br>
> <a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>
> <a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" rel=3D"n=
oreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-=
hol</a><br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" rel=3D"norefe=
rrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</=
a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
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