[101203] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] is there a word for "darth" ?
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (HoD qunnoQ)
Sun Sep 20 14:32:54 2015
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2015 21:32:28 +0300
From: HoD qunnoQ <mihkoun@gmail.com>
To: "lojmIt tI'wI' nuv" <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
Cc: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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now that i think of it,maybe the most correct way to say it would be
"veyDIr Hurgh" ; would i be right to think so ?
On Sun, Sep 20, 2015 at 8:30 PM, lojmIt tI'wI' nuv <
lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com> wrote:
> The short version of the answer:
>
> There is no known Klingon "word" for "Darth".
>
> The explanation, for anyone interested:
>
> First of all, words have meaning, and what, exactly, does "Darth" mean? Is
> it his first name? Is it his rank? Is it his title?
>
> So far as I know, there's only been one Darth, and I've never heard him
> referred to as either "Darth" or "Vader". Never anything like, "So, Darth,
> how's it going?" Never anything like, "Mr. Vader gave you an order!" Every
> reference to him that I can recall has been the naming pair "Darth Vader".
> If not for the pause, it might as well be one word: "Darthvader". -- Hmm.
> Maybe I've heard "Vader" alone, but I don't remember if that was in a
> movie, or just among people talking about the movies.
>
> Meanwhile, "Darth" is really hard to say in Klingon. The consonants at the
> end are just all wrong for the language. Attempts to transliterate might
> come out as {Dargh} or {Datlh} or {Dartlhe'} or {DarSe'} or {Darte'}.
> Unfortunately, my own guess as to how a Klingon ear might hear it favors
> {Dargh}, which is the Klingon word for "tea", which is a drink that doesn't
> get a lot of respect among Klingons, with an emotional connotation quite
> unlike the dark, fearful effect that "Darth" is clearly intended to convey.
>
> So, if "Darth" is a word and it has a meaning, we need to know what that
> meaning is before we attempt to find the closest Klingon word to that
> meaning. If it is more simply a proper noun with a sound, but no meaning,
> then we need to arbitrarily transliterate that sound, fixing the broken
> consonant cluster at the end, since the only consonant "r-something"
> cluster that can end a syllable in Klingon is {-rgh}, and there is no "th"
> sound in Klingon. We might be tempted to consider {tlh} the equivalent to
> "th" but it is at least as far from "th" as is {S} or {t}. Likely, {S} is
> the closest sound to "th".
>
> "Vader" is easier. It would be {veyDIr} or maybe {veyDer}. Again, this is
> transliteration, not translation, and human pronunciation is not consistent
> enough to be other than arbitrary in choosing one most accurate
> transliteration.
>
> Sent from my iPad
> lojmIt tI'wI' nuv
>
> > On Sep 20, 2015, at 12:15 PM, HoD qunnoQ <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > nuqneH
> >
> > i would like to ask if someone knows how to say in Klingon the word
> "darth" ; "darth" as in "darth vader".
> > i am pretty sure that if Klingons existed within the star wars mythos,
> they would make some of the best Sith lords ever.
> >
> > Qapla'!
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> > Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> > http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr">now that i think of it,maybe the most correct way to say i=
t would be "veyDIr Hurgh" ; would i be right to think so ?<br><di=
v class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Sep 20, 2015=
at 8:30 PM, lojmIt tI'wI' nuv <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mai=
lto:lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com<=
/a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:=
0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">=
The short version of the answer:<br>
<br>
There is no known Klingon "word" for "Darth".<br>
<br>
The explanation, for anyone interested:<br>
<br>
First of all, words have meaning, and what, exactly, does "Darth"=
mean? Is it his first name? Is it his rank? Is it his title?<br>
<br>
So far as I know, there's only been one Darth, and I've never heard=
him referred to as either "Darth" or "Vader". Never an=
ything like, "So, Darth, how's it going?" Never anything like=
, "Mr. Vader gave you an order!" Every reference to him that I ca=
n recall has been the naming pair "Darth Vader". If not for the p=
ause, it might as well be one word: "Darthvader". -- Hmm. Maybe I=
've heard "Vader" alone, but I don't remember if that was=
in a movie, or just among people talking about the movies.<br>
<br>
Meanwhile, "Darth" is really hard to say in Klingon. The consonan=
ts at the end are just all wrong for the language. Attempts to transliterat=
e might come out as {Dargh} or {Datlh} or {Dartlhe'} or {DarSe'} or=
{Darte'}. Unfortunately, my own guess as to how a Klingon ear might he=
ar it favors {Dargh}, which is the Klingon word for "tea", which =
is a drink that doesn't get a lot of respect among Klingons, with an em=
otional connotation quite unlike the dark, fearful effect that "Darth&=
quot; is clearly intended to convey.<br>
<br>
So, if "Darth" is a word and it has a meaning, we need to know wh=
at that meaning is before we attempt to find the closest Klingon word to th=
at meaning. If it is more simply a proper noun with a sound, but no meaning=
, then we need to arbitrarily transliterate that sound, fixing the broken c=
onsonant cluster at the end, since the only consonant "r-something&quo=
t; cluster that can end a syllable in Klingon is {-rgh}, and there is no &q=
uot;th" sound in Klingon. We might be tempted to consider {tlh} the eq=
uivalent to "th" but it is at least as far from "th" as=
is {S} or {t}. Likely, {S} is the closest sound to "th".<br>
<br>
"Vader" is easier. It would be {veyDIr} or maybe {veyDer}. Again,=
this is transliteration, not translation, and human pronunciation is not c=
onsistent enough to be other than arbitrary in choosing one most accurate t=
ransliteration.<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPad<br>
lojmIt tI'wI' nuv<br>
<div><div class=3D"h5"><br>
> On Sep 20, 2015, at 12:15 PM, HoD qunnoQ <<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun=
@gmail.com">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
><br>
> nuqneH<br>
><br>
> i would like to ask if someone knows how to say in Klingon the word &q=
uot;darth" ; "darth" as in "darth vader".<br>
> i am pretty sure that if Klingons existed within the star wars mythos,=
they would make some of the best Sith lords ever.<br>
><br>
> Qapla'!<br>
><br>
><br>
</div></div>> _______________________________________________<br>
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br>
> <a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>
> <a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" rel=3D"n=
oreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-=
hol</a><br>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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