[107413] in Cypherpunks
Re: Suggestion for Public Echelon counter-measures
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Dutra de Lacerda)
Wed Jan 13 17:03:30 1999
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 17:28:31 +0000
To: Anonymous <nobody@replay.com>
From: Dutra de Lacerda <dulac@ip.pt>
Cc: cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com
Reply-To: Dutra de Lacerda <dulac@ip.pt>
Please accept my congratulations to your very lucid comments!
It's not frequent to see such thoughts printed in a as clear manner as they
did.
>The whole idea that echelonites are harvesting e-mail for terrorists, bombs,
>etc. is ridiculous. By this time even the dumbest among "terrorists" have
>realised that YOU DO NOT USE E-MAIL OR FAX OR TELEPHONE to plan your
>operations.
'Terrorists' do not speak plainly on phones nor do plan actions by mail.
Not now, not before echellon was known (taps always existed), nor ever.
Now: Who does speak and write in plain words?!?
The People... Companies... Scientific Research... and some more groups.
Each target... At least one objective.
>Popularising the above idea just helps governments' cause - it supplies a good
>excuse for snooping. It is fucking sad that this idea comes from cypherpunks.
CypherPunks are a very heterogeneous group.
But I do agree on the general idea.
>ECHELON EXISTS BECAUSE IT MAKES BEHAVIOUR OF THE MASSES PREDICTABLE.
>It provides instant feedback to the brainwashing machinery. Today you
broadcast
>some silly sod of the president recite some PR on a policy issue. The same
>night you process all e-mails that mention this.
Social dynamics are a major discipline at Secret Services in pair with
Cryptology.
Under it we find Mass Control Techniques (immediate and general) and Social
Prediction
(more similar to wether prediction then expected as the structures are
almost identical)
>Tomorrow you can predict how 99% of the sheeple will "think" about it.
After few years
>you know what public will do and how much more it can take better than the
public itself.
>That is the purpose of Echelon AND THOSE OTHERS, UNNAMED YET, harvesting
>networks.
Not only: Economic and Scientific Intelligence are two other major objectives.
The first had proved determinant in "pushing" the USSR to it's end and is also
used in the war with Japan and Europe. Main beneficiary are some huge
corporations.
The second as medium and long term interest for both the military and those
corporations.
>THE GOVERNMENT BECOMES SUPERIOR OPPONENT - they know what
>you are going to do (on average) better than you do. They know your circle
of friends
>and their friends.
"Knowledge is Power"... This is a major rule... But "Power Corrupts" is
forgotten.
>I would not be surprised if they are selling digested opinions about products
>to the industry as a side job.
The links between the Industry and some services as tightened after the fall
of the USSR. But was already strong before due to several reasons:
- Information Cooperation... Multinationals as one of several alternative
sources.
- Technical Cooperation... Corporations as providers.
- Financing... Sometimes needed.
>The only way to fight this is wide spread use of encryption.
>Teaching someone to use PGP is not that much harder than explaining the
use of a new .sig.
Yes to the first, No to the second. People are generally dumb (yet) and
lazy (ever).
The massification of people led to the decivilazation process and control
increase.
It is expected to continue until Hell. The stupid thing about this is that,
ethics apart,
this is a self destruction process. Of nations and of "those" groups that
try, this way,
to achieve control of the planet. Expect the "recipe" to externally change
in the next
25 years... (Harvesting Information will remain solid).
Best Regards,
Dutra de Lacerda.
- - -
Antonio Manuel Melo de Carvalho Dutra de Lacerda
Morada : Rua Rodrigues Cabrilho, 5 - 5 Esq.
1400 Lisboa, PORTUGAL
Telefone : +351-(1)-3013579
FAX & BBS : +351-(1)-3021098
