[33000] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 4276 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sat Aug 23 14:09:14 2014
Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2014 11:09:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sat, 23 Aug 2014 Volume: 11 Number: 4276
Today's topics:
Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality <rweikusat@mobileactivedefense.com>
Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality <rweikusat@mobileactivedefense.com>
Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality <gamo@telecable.es>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2014 16:29:53 +0100
From: Rainer Weikusat <rweikusat@mobileactivedefense.com>
Subject: Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality
Message-Id: <87d2bslez2.fsf@sable.mobileactivedefense.com>
gamo <gamo@telecable.es> writes:
> El 20/08/14 a las 14:32, Rainer Weikusat escribi:
>> As demonstrated above (again), this is nothing which Perl doesn't
>> already have and has had for a while (syntax is transient, concepts are
>> persistent ...).
>
> I am open to new syntax if it offers something, as more
> simplicity or speed. E.g.
>
> @newlist = @list.pick(*);
>
> is the same as doing a shuffle from List::Util.
That's not really an example for 'new syntax' as the core is about
calling a builtin method on a list object. And writing
@newlist = shuffle(@list)
doesn't make much of a difference. It also doesn't quite fit into the
original example. What I was trying to get at is that 'syntax' is a
necessary evil when using feature of a programming language and in
itself, it doesn't matter (this is not so much different from natural
languages --- I didn't wrote "it doesn't matter" because I'm specially
in love with the sequence of graphemes but because it can be used to
express a meaning I wanted to express. Were "Fischer Fritz fischt heut
nix", I'd use that instead).
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2014 20:37:57 +0100
From: Rainer Weikusat <rweikusat@mobileactivedefense.com>
Subject: Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality
Message-Id: <878umgl3hm.fsf@sable.mobileactivedefense.com>
Forsythe <none@example.com> writes:
> G.B. <bauhaus@futureapps.invalid> wrote:
>> On 20.08.14 18:34, Rainer Weikusat wrote:
>>>>> If so, I think the
>>>>> >>'useful packages' are a secondary concern: If the language in itself is
>>>>> >>useful, it can be used within the limits of the available library
>>>>> >>support.
>>>> >
>>>> >Right. I think that if a scripting language is not intended
>>>> >to be a better shell then it is essential for it to have
>>>> >extensive and working library support. (It would be great
>>>> >to have a better shell.)
>>> And I think you're wrong: First and foremost, the language + runtime
>>> environment is useful (or not so useful) for 'programming stuff'. In
>>> case parts of 'stuff' are sufficiently generic and sufficiently
>>> complicated that using a third-party solution seems appropriate,
>>> availabilty of that is an option which is nice to have. OTOH, every
>>> piece of third-party code used is also a liability because it will
>>> have to be maintained and it will also cause work which could have been
>>> avoided. "There ain't no such thing as a free download".
>>
>> Can we have a quick show of hands?
>>
>> Who is using Perl in one or more serious projects and either
>>
>> [ ] - depends on something from CPAN or equivalent, or
>> [ ] - can use just the bare local Perl installation?
>>
>
> In my professional work I
>
> [ ] - depend on something from CPAN or equivalent, or
> [x] - can use just the bare local Perl installation?
>
> I would like to check the first box, but the environment in which I am
> paid to work is not an environment I can control, so I have had to
> reimplement a few wheels and, in some cases, curtail my use of Perl in
> favor of some other tool. Bare Perl still has a place of respect in
> our system and in my ~/bin/, however.
>
> That may seem to be a waffling, middle-of-the-road response, but it is
> accurate.
Other example: Using Perl as an embedded language, embedded in
PostgreSQL in my case. While CPAN modules could be used in this
situation, they're rarely useful because Perl is really just a more
powerful language for writing stored procedures (accessing the
facilities provided by the DB environment).
The code I'm presently working on, while it will probably only end up as
a few hundred lines, is supposed to enable import of some 70,000 AD
users into a certain user database without blowing up, something
the existing Java code for AD import cannot do. And that's seriously
serious because it is a core requirement for 'a large deal'.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2014 00:53:55 +0200
From: gamo <gamo@telecable.es>
Subject: Re: perl6 too much pointless functionality
Message-Id: <lt8hn1$bvk$1@speranza.aioe.org>
El 22/08/14 a las 17:29, Rainer Weikusat escribió:
>> @newlist = @list.pick(*);
>> >
>> >is the same as doing a shuffle from List::Util.
> That's not really an example for 'new syntax' as the core is about
> calling a builtin method on a list object. And writing
Of course it is new syntax.
1) The dot changes it's function
2) pick is a new method which could return one element of a list or
3) (*) refers to the whole list
"Syntax" comes from Ancient Greek σύνταξις "coordination" from σύν syn,
"together," and τάξις táxis, "an ordering"
--
http://www.telecable.es/personales/gamo/
------------------------------
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End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 4276
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